[HamWAN PSDR] VOTE: 900MHz service experiment

Sun Mar 8 20:32:52 PDT 2015

I agree with getting a long term antenna and one that continues our sectorized plan. YAY.

Nigel

> On Mar 8, 2015, at 12:30, Bart Kus <me at bartk.us> wrote:
> 
> I didn't go, nor would I trust HamWAN money to sketchy antennas.
> 
> I purchased the 3 modems recently approved (1 replacement 5GHz and the 2 900MHz modems) and saved money by combining shipping.  There is $118.12 left in approved funds to get a 900MHz antenna solution.  Baltic is asking for $204.59 to make the OD9-8 antenna happen (shipping included).  Laird's lower gain antennas also have crazy high shipping costs, and they quickly approach isotropic gain.  I don't think it's a good idea to spend $125 on shipping for what was supposed to be a low cost / low performance test antenna.  Longer-term, we would very likely employ a cross polarized MIMO system since bandwidth @ 900MHz is very limited and it's therefore important to maximize bit/Hz.  There is only one antenna on the market that I'm aware of that fits the bill: Ubiquiti AM-9M13.  It's a 13dBi 120 degree dual polarity sector.  I'm pretty sure they add the dBi from H+V polarizations to arrive at 13dBi, so it's probably 10dBi / polarization.  Still, 2dB better than the 8dBi OD9-8.  This     antenna is physically smaller, so the shipping is much cheaper.  It costs $278.36 shipped.  We'll also need a pigtail cable to adapt from the RP-SMA terminals on the antenna to the N-male on the modem.
> 
> Now, there are a couple advantages to going this route:
> 
> 1) We can re-use this antenna if we do deploy a 900MHz service since it's the only one I'm aware of that fits the bill.
> 2) The experimental phase can test both vertical and horizontal polarity performance independently by simply switching a cable.
> 
> So here's the modification:
> 
> 1x Credit from removing OD9-8 = ($118.12)
> 1x Ubiquiti AM-9M13 @ $252.00/ea = $252.00
> 1x RP-SMA to N patch cable (1m) @ $9.95/ea = $9.95
> 1x NF-NF barrel adapter @ $4.25/ea = $4.25
> 1x Shipping @ $36.60 = $36.60
> 
> Total additional funds requested: $184.68
> 
> If we don't end up doing a 900MHz service, or it doesn't use these components, we'll return or eBay the parts and credit the HamWAN balance.
> 
> --Bart
> 
> 
> 
> On 3/6/2015 7:59 PM, Tom Hayward wrote:
>> Try the swap meet tomorrow?
>> 
>> On Mar 6, 2015 7:55 PM, "Bart Kus" <me at bartk.us <mailto:me at bartk.us>> wrote:
>> Turns out the shipping on that 8dBi vertical is $125.
>> 
>> I'm open to suggestions at this point.
>> 
>> --Bart
>> 
>> 
>> On 3/6/2015 11:23 AM, Bart Kus wrote:
>>> I just sent you all the relevant invoices.
>>> 
>>> Thanks, board!  I guess I'm placing all the orders now.
>>> 
>>> --Bart
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 3/6/2015 11:19 AM, Cory (NQ1E) wrote:
>>>> Bart,
>>>> 
>>>> I also vote YAY on the contingency that you get caught up on the paperwork.  I still don't have the invoices on file from your last two purchases. ;)
>>>> 
>>>> That makes it unanimous, so I guess the voting is complete.
>>>> 
>>>> -Cory
>>>> NQ1E
>>>> 
>>>> On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 10:49 AM, Ryan Elliott Turner <ryan.e.t at gmail.com <mailto:ryan.e.t at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>> Thanks, Bart. I vote yay.
>>>> 
>>>> On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 12:47 PM, gary.k7ek at yahoo.com <mailto:gary.k7ek at yahoo.com> <gary.k7ek at yahoo.com <mailto:gary.k7ek at yahoo.com>> wrote:
>>>> I'd be interested in experimenting with 900 mhz gear at my Spanaway residence, and possibly at my Graham Hill repeater site. I believe 900 mhz would provide better overall results than 5 Ghz, which proved to be marginal to barely usable during our recent site survey.
>>>> 
>>>> Best regards,
>>>> 
>>>> Gary, K7EK
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone
>>>> 
>>>> ----- Reply message -----
>>>> From: "Bart Kus" <me at bartk.us <mailto:me at bartk.us>>
>>>> To: "Puget Sound Data Ring" <psdr at hamwan.org <mailto:psdr at hamwan.org>>
>>>> Subject: [HamWAN PSDR] VOTE: 900MHz service experiment
>>>> Date: Fri, Mar 6, 2015 10:38
>>>> 
>>>> Hello,
>>>> 
>>>> 5.9GHz is awesome when it works.  The speeds are great, and it carries 
>>>> as far as the eye can see with very low ambient noise floor.  It does 
>>>> however have problems when it needs to penetrate trees and buildings.  
>>>> To alleviate this, I'd like HamWAN to offer a slower but deeper 
>>>> penetrating 900MHz service.  900MHz is the lowest frequency ham band 
>>>> without bandwidth or modulation rate restrictions.  Before we deploy a 
>>>> full cell site, I'd like to get some real-world experience with 900MHz 
>>>> penetration, propagation and ambient noise conditions.  Here's the 
>>>> cheapest appropriate hardware we can use for this:
>>>> 
>>>> 1x Vpol omni antenna @ $79.50/ea = $79.50 
>>>> (http://www.balticnetworks.com/laird-antenna-omni-8dbi-900mhz-n-female-integrated.html <>)
>>>> 2x 9HPn modem @ $108.00/ea = $216.00 
>>>> (http://www.balticnetworks.com/mikrotik-metal-9hpn.html <>)
>>>> 1x Shipping @ $UNKNOWN (quote not showing?!  Need to call them.) = 
>>>> $40.00 ???
>>>> 
>>>> Total: $335.50
>>>> 
>>>> I already have a 900MHz high gain Yagi-Uda in my inventory and can use 
>>>> that to do various field tests.  These can be directly compared against 
>>>> 5.9GHz performance since the gear will be deployed to one of our 
>>>> existing 5.9GHz cell sites.  The results of such comparisons will give 
>>>> us a good idea of how well 900MHz might do for HamWAN.
>>>> 
>>>> Disclaimer: These may not be the right modems or antennas for us 
>>>> long-term.  A real deployment might use Ubiquiti Rocket M900 with their 
>>>> sector antennas.  These Ubiquiti items are far more expensive though, 
>>>> and their software doesn't integrate as easily into our network, so for 
>>>> the purposes of the test I believe the set of hardware I proposed will 
>>>> do well at deploying fast and keeping costs down.
>>>> 
>>>> NOTE: If both the votes are approved, I will combine shipping from 
>>>> Baltic to save money.
>>>> 
>>>> --Bart
>>>> 
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>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -- 
>>>> Ryan Turner
>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>> 
>>> 
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