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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple style='word-wrap:break-word'><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal>Phil, good luck making some progress on that. In the meantime, you should consider putting together a portable HamWAN client. Two of us NBAT volunteers have done that, a guy using a MikroTik SXT Lite5 on a camera tripod, and me using a MikroTik LHG XL HP5 on a homebrew portable stand. Inexpensive, of course you can move it around to a line of sight location as needed where you can run Winlink etc your laptop; theoretically, adding another pair to set up a bridge from there to an EOC might be a solution of getting around obstacles.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Stephen W9SK<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b>From:</b> PSDR <psdr-bounces@hamwan.org> <b>On Behalf Of </b>Phil Cornell via PSDR<br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 19, 2021 12:23 PM<br><b>To:</b> psdr@hamwan.org<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Newbie<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"'>This discussion of encryption is all very interesting but I think we got off track here. I was asking for help with setting up a new link. Right now it looks like the Thurston County EOC is questionable due to some trees blocking the view of Capital Peak from the parking lot. We need to see this view from the tower or building roof and that won't be happening anytime soon. My Plan C, ("A" was at my house, "B" was at the EOC) is to install it at Crawford Peak, just outside of the town of Rainier, and connect it to a new Fusion capable UHF repeater(OARS 441.400 pl103.5) and link to Capital Peak from there. That will require a lot of permissions, politics, and persistence. It will require working with TCOMM-911(building/tower owner), DNR(site manager), and Thurston County Sheriff(lease holder), the IT/Radio tech for TCOMM is very interested so this may be easier than expected.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"'>More details to follow.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"'>Phil Cornell </span></i><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"'>W7PLC </span></i><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"'>SHARES NCS590</span></i><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"'>Hybrid Gateway W7PLC</span></i><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"'>TCARES VP</span></i><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div><div id="ydpbc5ed814yahoo_quoted_7005400409"><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>On Friday, March 19, 2021, 12:00:10 PM PDT, <a href="mailto:psdr-request@hamwan.org">psdr-request@hamwan.org</a> <<a href="mailto:psdr-request@hamwan.org">psdr-request@hamwan.org</a>> wrote: <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>Send PSDR mailing list submissions to<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'> <a href="mailto:psdr@hamwan.org" target="_blank">psdr@hamwan.org</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'> <a href="http://mail.hamwan.net/mailman/listinfo/psdr" target="_blank">http://mail.hamwan.net/mailman/listinfo/psdr</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'> <a href="mailto:psdr-request@hamwan.org" target="_blank">psdr-request@hamwan.org</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>You can reach the person managing the list at<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'> <a href="mailto:psdr-owner@hamwan.org" target="_blank">psdr-owner@hamwan.org</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>than "Re: Contents of PSDR digest..."<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>Today's Topics:<br><br> 1. Encryption is (can be) Legal (Donald Rotolo)<o:p></o:p></span></p><div id=ydpbc5ed814ymsg75983><div id=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608><div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#1F497D'>Hello,</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#1F497D'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#1F497D'>To amplify Kevin’s comment below: </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#1F497D'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#1F497D'>In a conversation several years ago with Riley Hollingsworth, then the FCC’s enforcement guy, he emphasized to me that “obscuring the meaning” was not allowed, but encryption for other purposes was perfectly acceptable. I even wrote about it (“Encryption is Legal”, August 2006) in CQ Magazine (google it, it’ll come up somewhere).</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#1F497D'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#1F497D'>Granted, Riley is no longer with the FCC. But authentication != obscuring meaning, and lawyers focus on the meaning of the words as written. And, if it is not prohibited, it is allowed.</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#1F497D'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#1F497D'>So it all comes down to the purpose of the encryption, right? Purpose is obscuring meaning = Not allowed. Purpose is other, allowed.</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#1F497D'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#1F497D'>73, Don N2IRZ</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#1F497D'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in;border-color:currentcolor currentcolor'><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'> Kevin Walsh [<a href="mailto:w8khw1@gmail.com">mailto:w8khw1@gmail.com</a>] <br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, March 16, 2021 6:09 PM<br><b>To:</b> Puget Sound Data Ring <<a href="mailto:psdr@hamwan.org">psdr@hamwan.org</a>><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Newbie<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#26282A'></span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>Hello,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>The word encryption never appears in Part 97 rules, so its definition is irrelevant here. The key words in the rule are “intent” and “obscure”. So for instance, two people speaking pig-Latin with the intent of obscuring their conversation violate the same rule and the conversation is prohibited - even though it’s not encrypted.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>If I may, another option would be to get any of your associated Public Safety agencies to in part sponsor HamWan. Public Safety was granted access to the “special” Amateur Radio portion of 5.8GHz years ago and they CAN use (and in my state require) secure communication. Then you’re operating under Part 15 and the conversation is moot.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><a href="https://www.fcc.gov/public-safety/public-safety-and-homeland-security/policy-and-licensing-division/public-safety-spectrum" target="_blank">https://www.fcc.gov/public-safety/public-safety-and-homeland-security/policy-and-licensing-division/public-safety-spectrum</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>Just food for thought, I’ll go back to lurking now :-).<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>73, <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>Kevin<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>W8KHW <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=ydpbc5ed814yiv9818556608msonormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica Neue";color:#26282A'>_______________________________________________<br>PSDR mailing list<br><a href="mailto:PSDR@hamwan.org" target="_blank">PSDR@hamwan.org</a><br><a href="http://mail.hamwan.net/mailman/listinfo/psdr" target="_blank">http://mail.hamwan.net/mailman/listinfo/psdr</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></body></html>